Zack Hartle: 0:00

Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Watt's the Word and electrical industry podcast. I'm your host Zack Hartle joined, as always by Jason Cox. Hello, Jason, and what's on tap for us today?

Jason Cox: 0:12

Hey, Zack. Well, on today's episode, we are going to be talking with Dan Olson. Dan is the Senior Program Coordinator at careers, formerly known as careers the next generation.

Zack Hartle: 0:27

Absolutely, we're chatting with Dan all about entering the trades at a young age through the registered apprenticeship program, for the most part, and how careers works with students and with employers to kind of help facilitate that marriage of student apprentice and employer. I mean, it's a little close to home for me, as you remember, obviously, from a previous episode, I was actually a rap student about 12 years ago. So it's kind of interesting to see how there is an organization actually working towards getting young people into the trades as a viable career option, instead of pushing them into university degrees or into things that they you know, don't even know what they want to do. Right. So with that, I mean, let's jump right into our episode and welcome, Dan.

Jason Cox: 1:16

Dan, can you tell us about careers?

Dan Olesen: 1:20

You know, careers is a lot of things. First of all, it's a recognized industry driven not for profit charity foundation was started over 25 years ago. And, you know, as an organization, we have three major goals. One, go into the schools, and inspire students, parents and teachers, to the horizon of career opportunities in areas of skill shortages, to inspire employers to inject youth into their business into their industry. Three, create purposeful collisions between students and employers for internships, opportunities, or experiential learning or work integrated learning. We're best known for our work in the skilled trades and our work with the registered apprenticeship program or rap. But today, you know, our programming is including a lot of other programs beyond the skilled trades. So for example, you'll see us promoting opportunities in information and communication, technology, healthcare, agriculture, and some other demanding opportunities, Alberta is going to need to drive those economic engines.

Jason Cox: 2:51

One of the things you brought up there right away was, I mean, broadcasting out to the prospective young students, and then their employers who knows more about these opportunities? Typically, is the message getting out more to the employers or to the students?

Dan Olesen: 3:13

You know, that's a good question, actually. Um, when we're talking about careers in the skilled trades, with students, we're also deconstructing a lot of myths and stereotypes, right. So we're really actively working to promote the skilled trades at the same merit value in work. And that's new message to a lot of students and their supports employers, they know about the apprenticeship program. But sometimes they know, they don't know that the registered apprenticeship program is a natural thing. Or they've had a bad experience. And our job is to kind of make sure that the process for both the students and the employers is easy and rewarding. And really, you know, we get a lot of satisfaction when we're actually able to increase the probability for both the student and the employer. Right. So a lot of people think that careers owns the registered apprenticeship program. Maybe it's because it's misnamed or mislabeled. Wrap is actually a course like math 10. Nobody owns math. Right? So it is a course and it's recognized by Alberta education, and Alberta advanced education or the apprenticeship board. Right? And so it's actually a marriage of these these two bodies. And it come With a little bit of a different set of rules, you could say than traditional apprenticeship. So educating employers to those different rules is a big challenge or it's a big need. And then the biggest difference between the registered apprenticeship program and traditional apprenticeship is that students can earn 40% of their high school diploma in the workplace. Now, that's not crazy. But if you compare that to any other province in Canada, it's definitely an off campus education program with a little bit more strength behind. So but

Jason Cox: 5:51

absolutely Sorry to interrupt, but so up to 40% of your high school credit. Now, it may have changed a little bit in the last few years. But I personally, myself, I think of high school is grade 1011, and 12. So if you're getting 40% of your credit, I mean, that's almost like a full year of high school. For these programs for rap, are we starting that in grade 10?

Dan Olesen: 6:18

Yeah, some are. So really, you know, in my ideal scenario, and that's changing really quick, really quick. But in an ideal scenario, you have a student who in grade 10, is learning high school, learning about all the different options and opportunities that high school can give, right? And, and we come in, and we say, hey, let's look at opportunities and construction or vehicle and motor service or cook bakers and hairstyle. And they go, yeah, that's pretty cool. I want to try and be an electrician this summer. And so we take that student as part of off campus education, and they start exploring and experiencing the construction trade with an employer that's excited about injecting youth into their business. So then grade 11, comes, right. And so now the students in the employer have an option, like, Hey, do do I want to do all my courses the first semester, and work full time, the second semester, or, like, our friend, Zach here, worked full time the first semester, and then, and then go to school full time, the second semester, or maybe I just want to take advantage of all the courses that are available in high school. And so I'm just going to focus on high school for my grade 11 year, and then see where I met next summer. So, so often in Calgary, that's the most common center. Because of some of the perceptions. One of the reasons is because some of the perceptions around in the skilled trades, right. And, and of course, you know, if my my son or daughter, if they want to be in band and, and drama and just get those experiences, I totally encourage, then they come back in grade 11. And they go, You know what, I think given more responsibility, I'm actually seeing this treatment a totally different way than I did a year. So then again, to get to their grade 12 year, you know, by this time, they've earned probably 10 credits in the registered apprenticeship program, if they just did something. And now they can have the same options, again, work full time, or maybe they'll work in the mornings and go to school in the afternoon. If, if the project in the employer can make a schedule that fit, right. So they go to work in the mornings, often in the construction sector because of the toolbox seeking meetings. Right? They get 10 credits, the first semester of grade 1210 credits again in the second semester of grade 12. Now we're at 40 credits, the graduate grade 12, with 40 credits in the registered apprenticeship program. That's how it works.

Zack Hartle: 9:16

So that's very cool, Dan. And as you mentioned, there I was actually in the registered apprenticeship program 15 years ago now ish, but I do not remember how I got into it. A friend situation does doing it kinda. But if now if you're a student and you want to get into the program, you want to try out a trade or I don't know if there's an option to maybe try a couple different trades to see what you like, how would a student go about getting into the program?

Dan Olesen: 9:45

So often cases, wrap is actually often students don't go into rap right away. They actually start in a career internship or work experience. And that's where students can Get another five to 20 credits. Okay, hold on a second, you're probably thinking about the math here. But let's say we placed them in, in one of our favorite companies, and they don't sign up to be an apprentice that summer. So they got 10 credits and work experience. And that was their, their extra exploration grounds, right? If you combine work experience, taking credits and work experience and wrap credits, you now have 55 credits towards your high school diploma. Okay, now I heard what your question was Zack. So I'm getting to it, I promise. Before we can get the students enrolled in work experience in rap. One of the things that I love about this program is a prerequisite safety courses. And so these students have to do prerequisite workplace safety courses before they can even go out and work experience. And this is a rule by Alberta education, it doesn't matter what school division you go to. So to get enrolled, the very first thing that you have to do is connect with your off campus teacher at your high school. Now, most high schools have somebody appointed. But if they don't, then we can talk to their district and find out who in their district is responsible for our campus education. And if nobody's in their district is then we start figuring out other opportunities in collaboration with our school divisions, that's more complicated. In short, they go up to a counselor or an off campus teacher and say, I want to do work experience, I want to do rap. And then the teacher will say, Do you have a job? Yeah, my buddy's uncle has an opportunity for me, great. You know what, no, I don't know anybody in the electrical trade. Great, I'm going to introduce you to careers right away. And you're going to fill out an application, I'm going to tell him, you've approved you for off campus education, meaning you have a good citizenship, meaning you have a good, you know, good references from the school, you're working to complete your safety courses. And while we're doing that, careers is gonna go and see if they can find an employer. That makes sense.

Zack Hartle: 12:26

Typically, do you guys have luck with that? Do you have employers often willing to step up and take the students? Or is there a little bit more of a juggling act?

Dan Olesen: 12:35

There's always a little bit of a juggling act, right? Because he has to be a project that you can can use some extra talent, right for emerging talent, and that it has to be, you know, some sort of geographical makes sense, right? Because the students in Calgary can't really work outside of the city limits. Right. So there's a little bit of a juggling act. But I think that's one of the advantages that careers brings to the table for both stakeholders, and players in schools, is that we're creating that fit, we're aligning those objectives, or those those needs are those expectations, so that the whole process for the student and the employer look seemingly ease that answer your questions that?

Zack Hartle: 13:30

Yes, definitely. I remember nothing of the process. I just remember, my friend was doing it said go talk to the counselor. I went, I said, Hey, did some stuff I don't know, so long ago. And then I guess I was lucky, right? When I came in, there was an economic boom, right? So there was people looking for green first year apprentices and I was very green, I can tell you that. So

Dan Olesen: 13:53

you also have to kind of aligned sometimes a little bit of personality. Right? You know, when I young woman applies to be in the trades, you know, there's lots of employers that are forward thinking and Equal Opportunity employers, but sometimes, it just makes sense to place a female student who's just exploring the opportunities, and is a little bit more nervous with a female dream person. Right? Because then that mentorship can really bond with relatable experience. Right? So sometimes you can take that idea and you can think about ethnicity. Right? You can think about some students are really, really more timid. And they need that employer that has that ability to break through that shell a little bit. And then there are students who are, you know, a little bit too courageous, and you got to put them with more safety conscious employer with more strict programs so that they can kind of bridle that. That enthusiasm

Jason Cox: 15:02

I've got a question here, it seems that the career counselors in the schools are a critical part to this whole marriage of careers. And our who is the one that's speaking to these counselors to ensure that they are aware of the other options other than just post secondary education? Being a university degree?

Dan Olesen: 15:30

Yeah, everything that careers does is in collaboration with our schools without our schools supporting the program. Wrap doesn't exist. Okay. But I hear what you're saying. I think that the responsibility rests on the community. And every stakeholders from, from our partners and our friends at sait, to our, our friends at the apprenticeship board, to the employers that have their their students going to that school, I can tell you a few stories, right. So that it has to come from multiple channels. But careers is definitely I take it as a responsibility. I don't know if it's a careers, you know, mission statement. But it's it's definitely upon my responsibility that I've had the privilege of meeting some of the most influential industry leaders this province has to offer. And every opportunity I have to add caliber to the discussion of what the trades are. I do it. Sometimes it takes 10 years, I've had science teachers come up to me. After nine years of presenting to 27,000 students, he came up to me he says, you know, again, sort, I didn't even know who the guy was. I said, What are you sorry, about, he says, you can come in here every year. And this is the first time I've ever seen your presentation. I didn't see the relevancy of my science class, seeing your presentation. And I get it now. Right? So it's a little bit more. You got to be consistent. And you got to be employing your principles and your critical thinking and your willingness to listen, and your willingness to prove yourself wrong.

Jason Cox: 17:35

That I've known you for probably close to 10 years now. So So you've been you've been working with careers for quite some time. Are you seeing that that that epiphany or that change where you're talking to schools now versus when you first started out?

Dan Olesen: 17:51

Um, yeah, right, I see a lot more programming and a lot more discussions and a lot more opportunities surrounding the skilled trades and the development of skilled trades. I don't always agree with some of the strategies that are around these initiatives. But I do see a higher frequency of communication.

Zack Hartle: 18:18

And with that higher communication are, you know, over the last 10 years, are we seeing a higher turnover from students getting into the trades? Like more students per year? Are you trending upwards? I guess, would be my question.

Dan Olesen: 18:31

Yeah, absolutely. Definitely. Placing more students, we're definitely on an upward trajectory before COVID. Right. And in careers in collaboration with our other programming. We have an intended target of about 6000 interns across Alberta, by 2023. And right now, well, before COVID, we were replacing about 1500. So we placed 1600. Last year, and I think this year, we're looking at 2500.

Zack Hartle: 19:07

And that was going to be my next question about how COVID has maybe made it more difficult for you guys, or, as we've heard from a lot of other guests to maybe given you guys opportunities to do things a little bit differently.

Dan Olesen: 19:18

Yeah, COVID is, you know, complex, has has had a complex, you know, effect on the social phenomenon surrounding the skilled trades. Right. And I wish I was smarter to talk about it, but the the economic challenges facing a lot of companies and COVID and everything else we saw, we saw a large exodus of foreign talent or outside talent in Alberta lead again. And so that's created a lot of opportunities for for, or has created a strong need to grow some local talent Right. So, on one hand, that's good. I think one of the biggest challenges is the micro conversations, right? Where, you know, we get on these zoom calls, and one of the things that we want to do is get off these zoom calls. And so when you have a construction teacher or a CTS teacher that's trying to connect with Allison or Mohammed or Johnny, who are in the CTS classes, because they like to, you know, take what's going on here and putting it into here. Well, for them to sit on a zoom call, they're going Batty, right? So, you know, that CTS teacher doesn't really have the opportunity to have that micro conversation and say, Hey, Muhammad, you know, I've been seeing how you've been solving this complex problem in your, in your carpentry class. And you might have the foundation of skills to attrition. But they're not having that conversation, because you can't do that on Zoom. Very easily. Right? You don't see Allison running down the halls and, and watching the electrician run wires through the ceiling. And her going, what are you doing? Right? And the teacher saying, Hey, you're really interested in that. Let's talk about that. So those micro conversations are hurting. And then of course, all the restrictions and, and perceptions of COVID. And those fears and those risks. They've all created all these little micro barriers that we have to solve. I could go on, but I'm still like I'm battling.

Zack Hartle: 21:51

That's good. That's answered my questions. That's perfect.

Jason Cox: 21:55

He could be in store for a huge tidal wave of post COVID items, right? We just we don't even know what they are. Because like you said, there has been an exodus from the province. And there's been people that have been put aside and paused and I mean, thrown like, tilt left field. So we don't know what's what's going to happen moving forward here. So this kind of bridges into my next question. So I asked you a moment ago, about students entering the trades as young as grade 10. Yeah. What's the what's the age limit? So I've graduated high school, am I still eligible for any of these programs?

Dan Olesen: 22:36

You've graduated high school, you're still eligible to be an apprentice, right? Yeah. If someone's crazy enough to hire you, they careers is really focused, has really been focused on on high school students up north, we have a Co Op program. What we're seeing now with careers is we're right now trying to develop messaging or strategies around you, 21, or persons under the age of 21. And it looks like it's going to be a good idea. Because, you know, COVID, has had an impact on high school education for two years now, and probably is going to continue to have an impact for at least a little while. Right. So there's a lot of people who are leaving high school on this trajectory that they thought they were going to be on that didn't get access to the different ideas or different options that were available. And they're going to be saying, they're going to still have the same questions for the same challenges. So we're going to have to support that group under the age of 21. So to access careers programming right now, Jason, you have to be 21 years less a day. And that's for the skilled trades. The other programming like agriculture and ICT, you have to be in high school.

Zack Hartle: 24:09

So Daniel mentioned that you're here in Calgary, I assume Calgary is kind of your area and I know you look after electrical but in your portfolio in this position, do you look after other trades or other areas as well?

Dan Olesen: 24:21

Absolutely. All 49 Plus trades are eligible. Now there's certain trades that are really harder to place like we don't please a lot of high school students as crane hoist operators. But we do figure out ways to connect them to the industry in other ways. Barbers, hairstyles, cooks, bakers, appliance service technician, welders. We're working with all of them. And we're really, we've been doing that since 1997 1992. And you We're also taking the best parts of apprenticeship and trying to apply it to the other sectors. You know, and this is kind of related to maybe some of the things that we're going to see with the development of Bill 67. I don't know, it's kind of above my pay bracket. But, you know, imagine we could get every single high school student, or recent high school student exploring and experiencing their careers before post secondary, so that they could choose the best path and their commitment to lifelong learning with a fit for purpose. And so when we look at careers, like in technology, like software developments, right, there's some aspects in those careers where you need that university degree. But sometimes, all you really need to know is maybe the foundation of skills for Python, to get that job and start contributing to the economic engine.

Zack Hartle: 26:09

Well, that's that's how I answer the question. Every time someone asked me like, Oh, what do I need to be a good apprentice electrician, well, show up on time and listen and work hard, like you don't need for a lot of jobs, especially in the skilled trades, you don't need a lot of knowledge about what you're doing. You just need to show up and listen to the people who know what they're doing. Right. Like that applies across all those careers that you guys put forward.

Dan Olesen: 26:35

Yeah, you know, then sometimes there's a foundation of skills that are required, right, depending on the opportunity, like, it's really hard to place an electrician when they don't even know what a Phillips screwdriver is, right? It's kind of hard. We've done it, right. But it's hard. But yeah, so, you know, I've been saying, For 10 years more, there's only four things you need. Teamwork, willingness to put the interest of others ahead of your own positive attitude. I'm not saying you have to come to work every day with a big smile on your face, but you have to be willing to do the tasks and responsibilities assigned to you to the best of your abilities, strong work ethic, which is just accountability, to do the job to the best of your abilities, and most importantly, a willingness to learn. And if you come to every opportunity, and it for a guy like me who barely graduated high school, I gotta tell you, that's what saved my butt more than a few times. Just that unbridled willingness to learn. So, it's really important that, that every new apprentice brings that to to the table. But it's funny, because employers often tell asked me, you know, what do they need to provide students for them to be successful? Same thing. Right, it's just like, you gotta you got to treat them, like you're willing to put their interests sometimes ahead of your own, you know, you have to, you have to listen to them and, and assign them tasks and responsibilities that are encouraging to them. Right? And if you suck at mentorship, then you have to be willing to learn how to be a mentor. Right? And it's not the students fault. Right? And that's kind of kind of where I can go off on another rant on that. But it's not about money. It really isn't. Right. A lot of employers say, Oh, I don't know, we have the money for this. Well, if you actually know how to assign tasks effectively and efficiently, you can make money on anybody. Really, you're just not running your businesses smoothly. And maybe that's really easy to say, as the guy who's not running a business. But, you know, I have been an entrepreneur and I've hired lots of different kinds of people. Well, I

Jason Cox: 29:23

really liked what you mentioned earlier, you talked about learning, and learning doesn't necessarily have to happen in the classroom. Right? So with your vision, or your your thought about being able to go and go out and experience your prospective career before you actually make that commitment to all the formalized education. But I mean, that could be an incredible learning activity. Right, right off the bat, and I mean, everybody now learns outside of the classroom. But when you talk to people who are Older there, oh, I, I didn't like school. I didn't like that. And then the next day you talk to them about fixing an appliance in their house. And they're like, Oh, how did you do that? Oh, I just watched a YouTube video. Right? I read this book, or my neighbor showed me, right? So you're continuing to learn, but you're learning from your friends, your neighbors, your peers, or maybe from a video shot online. Right. But yeah, I, I'm exactly on the same, same train of thought, as you. Like, if I could go out and actually just participate in the career I thought I'd like to have before I invested all that time. What a great idea.

Dan Olesen: 30:47

You know, and it just doesn't have to be about the position. Like I worked with a bunch of students on a weekly basis last year. And, and I asked him, What's the one thing you would want me to change about the program? And they said, Dan, put less focus on the position, and more on the mission of the company. What? And they're like, you know, we get shoveled these opportunities all the time, but you're always telling us you can teach us the skill. Okay, so tell us more about why the company exists. What is it that they want to achieve? And how am I going to be a part of that success? I'll learn the skills, but I want you to inspire me first. I was just like, you're in grade 11. And you're telling me this? Okay. Right. A tall order, Dan. I know, right? But you know, so I remember years ago, this kid came up to me and he said, Dan, I really want to be a firefighter. And I said, okay, but ain't good for you. I can't help you. I don't police firefighters. He's like, No, you don't understand. I want to learn the construction industry, because that'll make me a better firefighter. And I said for grade 10. Logic, buddy, that's brilliant. Let's go with that. And so we put them out in the construction industry, is that a ladder interior systems mechanic. Okay. Nobody knows what that trade is, by the way, that's fun. And, and he goes into it. And guess what, he loved it. And so, you know, fast forward three years is the guy. You know, fast forward five years is the guy a firefighter is the guy a ladder interior systems mechanic, know, he's going into safe to take Construction Project Management. Right? He fell in love with an industry. This isn't just about growing skilled trades people. This is about crawling future leaders, people who can step into being an instructor, being an entrepreneur, being a project manager, being a civil engineer, and actually respecting the industry, and every piece of that puzzle. Arias gives me all excited, but I have a saying that I still I go into a shop who was an auto body mechanic. And, and I said, I can't remember the remark that I said, and I and I said, Yeah, you know, every kid has to start at the bottom. And he said, Well, we'll we'll Don't ever say that in my shop. I said, Okay, I thought I seriously offended the guy. He says nobody that starts working here starts the bottom. Everybody started to begin. And, and, you know, like, what a change in in the language. Right. And so now, you know, as Bill Black from the president or the president of the CCA would say, you know, an opportunity in the construction sector is one of the few industries where you can go from broom to Boardroom. Right. Maybe it's a little bit about the respect and the honor and the privilege of holding a broom. And everything that comes with that. It's not about pushing the broom it is but it's also the opportunity to look around, see what's happening and go Yeah, I'm working for this electrical company, but that plumber over there. Learn what that guy is doing. Right. If I could go back I'd be a plumber. No offense electricians, but I'd be a plumber.

Jason Cox: 35:00

It seems that a lot of times on job sites, it's it's like the plumbers and the electricians are the ones that like we really have to coordinate together. So we kind of, it's like we're brothers, like, I know fighting big brother, little brother or fighting twins or whatever. But, I mean, usually we get along on the job sites.

Dan Olesen: 35:22

But you know, I think that's what a lot of, you know, and you hear it from companies all the time, like, man, if this engineer had worked at day, he wouldn't be designed in this crazy. Honest, it's like, well, why aren't why aren't they working through today? Yeah.

Jason Cox: 35:41

Yeah. And I mean, that's the thing is, it's when you're an engineer, it's such a vast profession, right? Even I mean, even if you're just an electrical engineer, so I, I am very inquisitive. And I asked lots of questions. So I had an engineer on my site once and I think you're an engineer, I go European. She goes, Yeah, I go, Great. Can you explain to me how this works, and he's like, and he was like, he's like, my things, lighting or my things fire alarm, he goes, I have no idea how the electronics and that works. But it's the vast world. And is

Zack Hartle: 36:16

Sudan coming at this from an employer's side of things a little bit more, we've been talking about the opportunities for the students a lot. I'm an employer, what's the advantage to me of coming in finding somebody in the registered apprenticeship program versus putting an ad on Facebook or LinkedIn or whatever and getting? Who knows who

Dan Olesen: 36:38

I'm, I'm not gonna say you can't find great talent by putting an ad out. But let's just say you had two people have equal intelligence, equal potential. And one was doing was applying for the job because the company inspired them to do it. And, and they saw it as a cool opportunity, and really wanted to do it. And the other person was doing it because you needed a job. And there was$1 figure attached to it. Who do you think it's going to bring more in the long term? Right, if you can actually say, Wow, you really, genuinely just want to be here. What? Because I want the experience I want to learn, you can pay me minimum wage, I don't care. Okay, so I have to talk about safety. And then a lot of people, a lot of organizations have come to me and said, Dan, we only hire people over the age of 18. And I go, Okay, why? Well, because they're more safe. Kate, what magic trigger happens? Oh, well, they're more mature. Really. Right. You have 400 students that are getting recommendations, taking safety courses, filling out applications, doing resumes, doing screening, just to get an internship over the guy who's playing on Kijiji ad for 18 bucks an hour. So what's interesting is that if safety was the real big issue, and you had a choice of hiring a guy, or girl that worked at the movie theater, no, nothing movie theaters a bad job. But you know, it's a little bit less structured, there's a little bit more horseplay allowed, right? Or you hire that 16 year old that had to learn safety protocols every day, every morning. From the very first job that they have, what habits you want to buy first?

Jason Cox: 39:07

It's the habits. Yeah, you're 100%. Right. In one of our previous podcasts, one of the guests talked about getting people that were green, so they could start to build them into the employee that they wanted. And you're right here too. If if somebody comes into the industry right away, and they begin their day, every day with that safety protocol, than to them that's just not that's just normal. Right. So that that could be invaluable.

Dan Olesen: 39:38

Yeah, average age of a first year apprentice in Alberta. How old is it? You know?

Jason Cox: 39:43

I'm going to take in I've got a number of my head Zack, what do you got a number?

Zack Hartle: 39:48

I got a number. Yeah, I would say 26

Jason Cox: 39:51

I guess 23

Dan Olesen: 39:55

I think I told Zack this before good. She's like dead on it Hmm, first year bread isn't Alberta, last time I checked, most are going in when they're 19. But the average age 26. Now, now, when we think about this, you know, I'm not an expert in adult education theory or in biological sciences. But if we actually look at the ability to learn versus the effort toward or compared to the effort to learn, once we hit 25, the quarter life crisis, right? The the effort to learn starts to being an impeding factor, like a real imputing. Factor. And so, so, even if they're hiring most of the apprentices at 19, and that's their first job, you're spending more time and more money because a 19 year old is going to request demand more money than a 16 year old, right, just in terms of wages. So you're spending more money and more time to indoctrinates or socialize basic employability skills. Right, because I've never had a job. So you're, you're actually going through that culture shock at 19. versus spending less money. And having this arsenal of coaches like an off campus teacher, parents careers, all these people working together to teach these employability skills. So by hiring younger, you're actually going to expedite talent and innovation to production. But employers don't see it that way. Because they say, well, it's gonna take three years for that kid to be 19. Yet, but at 19, my kid's gonna be worth 20 was a 23 year old and he still has from 19 to 20. Before he's 23,

Jason Cox: 42:05

you could look at it from the perspective of a hockey player. Right? That's good. He's got all the skill, but yeah, we can, obviously, yeah, but we can put them into that contract for four extra years. Right. So.

Dan Olesen: 42:18

But it does make a lot of economic sense, right? To grow your game, if we actually sat down and thought about how much adult education costs, and we realized that this was a multi billion dollar industry, why? Right, it's hard. It's really a hard thing to do. Engineering, and inspiring youth to be everything that they are and everything that they should be. Well, that's easy, relatively. And it's fun. So now you can have your third year, apprentice, learning leadership, learning mentorship, learning culture of the business, by teaching high school students. Right, you can actually infuse it in through your entire industry, or your entire company. And here's the best part, here's what's really good. Does anybody know what the average costs of getting local talent from, from, hey, a job exists to shovel on the ground? No idea. Know. So you know, numbers are all over the place, but it's anywhere from you know,$1,500 to 7000, on average. So that means the company has to put out marketing, they have to, they have to pick if they want to do it on Indeed, GG, whatever, they have to sift through all the applications, all the resumes, right, then they have to host the interview, schedule, the interviews, then do all the other stuff that comes up. And there's organizations like careers that are supported by industry supported by government that's doing all that work for free. So you take that every time you hire a student, you're gonna get a higher probability of getting our emerging best. without all the extra stuff that doesn't really add value to your business.

Zack Hartle: 44:43

Did these employers need to commit to a length of time to employ the apprentice? Like do they have to commit to the seven months for summer and semester or anything like that?

Dan Olesen: 44:55

No, I think there's an ethical obligation, right like Taking a kid for two days and then cutting them loose, back might just be a jerk move to do, right? Unless it's like safety related. Like in all new hires, right, if they're a threat to themselves or a threat to the organization, of course, you can let them go after an hour, five minutes, I don't care. But if you're going to take on a student, then I'm going to encourage it, the employer and the student had this unbridled willingness to learn, right, so that means they're working the project for at least 75 to 125 hours, that gives a student five credits towards your high school diploma, good three weeks to learn the culture, maybe learn some do's and don'ts, and really see if you can, you know, expedite a potential for development. That's pretty much what I asked.

Zack Hartle: 45:57

Is there hotspots in the province? Like, do you see a lot more rap students in Calgary versus Edmonton or anything like that?

Dan Olesen: 46:05

Um, you know, I think culture has a lot of things to do with it. I think that, you know, work integrated learning and being able to marry the workplace with schooling is is a really good idea. But in Calgary, I would say that there's opportunities, but the idea of a student working half days, and going to school half days, in the construction sector, is less frequent. But definitely more common in Edmonds, or red deer or some of our rural districts. Right. So why is that?

Zack Hartle: 46:50

Great question.

Dan Olesen: 46:52

You know, and we can we, we can see that it's, you know, culture of the family and philosophies there that, you know, my kid has to focus on school and schools. That's it. We can say that there's an I don't know if this is true or not, I have no idea. But, you know, is there a more of a push for Tavi students to go to university than there is seen Edmonton or some of the rural communities? You know, those would all be interesting questions? Or are students just more entitled? And it's like, Man, I don't mind working in summer, but you want me to work out in the cold? Forget, you don't want to do that. Maybe that's what it is. Right? And then, of course, it can go down to the schools. Right. The schools are definitely forwarding and education agenda and how they're funded. Right? I don't, I'm wondering if this is gonna get me fired, actually, by telling you this? I don't know. Maybe I should think about politics. Right. But the schools have to be able to offer the curriculum, right. And, and the community has to be willing to support it. At the end of the day, it's not a government problem. It's not a schooling problem. It's not a state problem. It's an industry problem. Industry has to be willing to play a part in the education process. And, and when they do, everything happens faster. And it hasn't better than relying on somebody else, to come up with the solution that they need. If they see the solution, they should be participating in it, not relying on somebody else to come up with it for

Jason Cox: 48:51

what would be the best way for interested parties to kind of get in contact with careers about potential opportunities.

Dan Olesen: 49:03

The best way to get in contact with careers is pick up your phone and call, call your local program coordinator connect with them on LinkedIn. clinic careers website is probably the easiest thing to do and send them an email. The one thing that careers has is this energy and passion to help everybody. There's nobody that's working in careers that is waiting for an opportunity. We're all trying to look at the glass half empty. And that doesn't mean that we're pessimists. It just, we recognize what we have. And we're all looking for the opportunities to Comorian.

Zack Hartle: 49:56

And you know, Dan, I think that you are a prime example. have that and your unbridled enthusiasm for what you do? How did you get like, how did you end up in this position? Because I don't think you have a trade, if that's correct. How'd you get here? Being a spokesperson for the trades and other careers, I guess,

Dan Olesen: 50:17

I went to a wedding and I was sitting at a table. And some person made a smart remark about being a plumber. And I was a little bit under the influence. And so I went off on one of my passionate rants as I'm known for. And this person said, That was brilliant. Here's my card. And I looked at the card, and I showed it to my wife. And she's like, Yeah, I know who that is. And I said, Who's that? Well, he's, he's the vice president of Stakeholder Relations for careers and, and in Canada supports careers. And I said, Oh, she's like, you should look into it. And so because she was encouraging me, because her the relationship in Canada had and now Synovus has with careers. I kind of think that company for, for having the seeds in place for me to do what it is that I

Jason Cox: 51:26

do. That's very cool. Yeah. Yeah.

Dan Olesen: 51:30

So without, without those connections, and wanting to be a plumber, I don't think I'd be where I am.

Jason Cox: 51:41

Yeah, you're very passionate to different I've never seen anyone defend a plumber that wasn't a plumber. So that's, that's, that's really good for you.

Dan Olesen: 51:52

Not that I don't love electricians. Right. I've learned a lot from hanging out with electricians, and our mutual friends. And, you know, I gotta say, it's just like some of the some of the trades people that I've met as a result of this, this connection that I've been able to make with industry leaders. That's where the passion comes from. Right? You meet all these great people, all these smart people, some of them are rough around the edges. Some of them are absolute nerds, right. But you take a piece of what they know what they've experienced, and what they would want to share if they can get on the same soap boxes that I was getting on. And so I just take a piece from everybody stitch them all together, and hopefully come up with some sort of message that can resonate with the listeners. So it has nothing really, I'm glad that you guys think I'm passionate. And then that's what I really want to convey. But really what I'm doing is I'm just feeling the passion from everybody else. And hopefully, I'm being a respectable vehicle for what they would want to see if they were standing in the same place as I was,

Zack Hartle: 53:13

and willing to speak as loudly as you speak about it.

Dan Olesen: 53:17

Yes, that's true. Now, how

Jason Cox: 53:19

long have you been with careers now?

Dan Olesen: 53:21

I'm in my 11th. Year. So I want to say yeah, presented to over 27,000 students. I don't know how many employers are. I've on boarded more than 400 new employers to the program. For sure. I've helped connect, probably about 1000 students to career up to employers who were excited to inject youth into their business. And hopefully, I've crowd the cages, if you will, of, you know, a few 1000 parents and teachers and people who had a misunderstanding of what it means to be an Albertan.

Jason Cox: 54:26

Well, I'm on your website right now. So it's www dot careers next gen.ca. Is that correct? Yeah. And the phone number is 1-888-757-7172. I believe that's the number so toll free anywhere in the province if people want more information on careers.

Zack Hartle: 54:49

All right. Right before we sign off, Dan, what's your one last piece of advice for a student? And what's your one last piece of advice for an employer

Dan Olesen: 54:57

my last piece of advice for a student and I've said This is probably every single presentation I've ever done. The next time somebody asks you, what are you going to do with the rest of your life? You look them straight in the eye. And you say, I have no idea. And I'm going to start here, I'm gonna start by doing this right or wrong pass or fail, I'm gonna be better as a result of the experience. For the employers, it's simple. You know, let's, let's build your business, let's build your industry. And let's figure out a way to, to connect you with our emerging best. If that's high school, if that's a different group, great. But let's work together to to better prepare Alberta for the road ahead. And for the employers, you know that quickly, right now in 2022, is February 17. If they were to contact careers right now and say, hey, I want to hire a high school students for the summer, they might be eligible to get about $10,800. To hire that student. Now, I want to be clear. And curious isn't telling me to say this, this isn't about hiring cheap labor. This is about taking advantage of government funding, to build the spin within your business, to to engage youth in your community effectively and efficiently, and start building the mentorship standards within your business. If you just see the talent as $8 An hour talent, you're not going to be in a better place two years from now. That's my position. And, and that's, that's the Alberta. That's the future, I think is worth working for. Well,

Zack Hartle: 57:15

thank you very much, Dan, for chatting with us today.

Dan Olesen: 57:20

Thanks for having me, guys. It's always a pleasure to hang out with the two guys that I look up to in the world.

Jason Cox: 57:26

Thanks a lot. That was a great conversation with Dan, I learned a little bit more about entry into the trades stuff that you would have experienced Zack. And I think in that interview, you actually said that there was parts to that entry in your journey that that you kind of forgotten about or, or were in a little fuzzy. So it was really good for Dan, to remind us on some of the some of the benefits of the rat program and some of the services available by careers. Kind of reflecting on that episode. Zach, was there anything any big takeaway that you got out of it?

Zack Hartle: 58:08

I think what stands out to me, and I mean, this has been a something we've talked about for is like, there's still that stigma about entering the trades, there's still an need for people. I mean, we've got a little bit of a labor shortage starting in right now. And apparently, it's going to be getting worse. I mean, again, yeah, the hard part is just getting that message across to whether it be schools or whether it be students or whether it be parents, I'm not sure who that message needs to get to, but just that trades of of any type are a viable option, right, so that we can get more young people into the trade, whether it's going to be something they do for their whole life, or whether it's a stepping stone to move on to something else. I mean, one of the quotes that came up today is right, you know, trades is one of the only places you go from room to Boardroom. Right. And I that that kind of resonated quite a bit with me because it it is a stepping stone, it can be a path to so many other things. Or it can be a solid, good 40 year career. Right. There's kind of choose your own adventure almost with apprenticeship and trades.

Jason Cox: 59:14

Yeah, and I think we could do an entire episode on the stigma of the trades. It's something that's bothered me for a long time as being guilty of being on both sides of that I've probably talked about that in the past. But I think my neatest takeaway for me on this was, I am a parent of two young adults, and I had no idea the amount of high school credits that were available. So I think Dan said in excess of 40, up to a maximum of 55 credits was was I think what he explained which are

Zack Hartle: 59:52

like the half right, that'd be just over half of your high school. Right.

Jason Cox: 59:56

Exactly. Right. So I mean, that was it. That was a The big takeaway for me, but the thing that really impressed me was the the mandatory safety training for the rap students. Prior to getting the work experience. I think you're setting an example right off the bat where you have the safety in place. The expectations are made before the students go on to the job site. So they're at least aware of some of the possible dangers and hazards. I was very impressed by that.

Zack Hartle: 1:00:36

And I agree with that completely. So I mean, I think the message here at the end of this episode is if you are a parent of someone if you are an employer looking for apprentices, or if you know somebody who's of high school age and you think trades might be right for them, I think careers is a great resource to reach out to hit up their website, which we will link in the description below. As always, if you enjoyed this show, make sure you leave a review on Apple or Spotify. Check us out on Facebook or Instagram @wattsthewordpodcast and for now, have a great day and thank you so much for listening